Question: Why did God order Israel to kill men, women and children?
In the Old Testament there are a number of instances of God telling Israel to completely wipe out the peoples who inhabited the land called Palestine (e.g. Deut 7:1-4,16,24). Doesn’t that make the God of the Old Testament a harsh and unjust God, completely different from the God of love portrayed in the New Testament?
Answer:
If we are to adequately answer this we will have to give careful consideration to what the Bible says.
To understand this apparent situation we need to understand:
a) the nature of God
b) the nation of Israel and the surrounding nations
c) the options of the inhabitants.
a) The Nature of God
The Bible’s descriptions of God are not at variance between Old and New Testaments.
For example in the Old Testament we find God saying, “The soul who sins is the one who will die.” (Ezek 18:5)
In the New Testament, we find the apostle, Paul, writing “the wages of sin is death” (Rom 6:23).
However, in the Old Testament we also find God declaring, “I take no pleasure in the death of anyone” (Ezek 18:32).
Similarly in the New Testament, we find the apostle, Peter, writing about God, “He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish.” (2 Peter 3:9)
Now in both testaments, the way to avoid death was quite clear:
“Repent and live!” (Ezek 18:32) and “not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance” (2 Peter 3:9).
For the moment that will be enough about God:
- sin will be punished by death
- God doesn’t want death to come to man
- death is avoided by repentance, turning away from the sin.
b) The Nation of Israel and the Surrounding Nations
i) Israel
Israel were a nation created by God, starting from Abraham, then through Isaac and finally through Jacob, who was renamed Israel by God. While in Egypt the families grew over about four hundred years to become the equivalent of a nation of well over a million people.
At the Exodus (see Exodus, chapter 1 to 12) God took them out of Egypt and meeting with them at Mount Sinai created a new nation out of them who would be a special people, specifically related to God (see Exodus 19). The objective of this was to show the world the possibility of a nation being led and guided by God, i.e. to act as a light to the rest of the world, revealing the goodness of God and His plan for His world.
To achieve this possibility God instructed them to remove all the existing inhabitants of the land in order to create a new national identity.
ii) The Surrounding Nations
When we look at the people that Israel were told to destroy, we are told they were to be destroyed because of their wickedness (Deut 9:4), and because they worshipped idols and would turn Israel to those idols and away from God (Deut 7:4,16).
The picture we are given is of nations in possession of the land God had promised Israel, who were totally established in worshipping idols and all of the practices that went with that (e.g. sacrificing children).
From the beginning of the Bible we are shown mankind that has a propensity to turn away from God and turn to all kinds of foolish life styles that can only be described as pagan and uncivilised in the extreme!
This propensity to turn away from God is what the Bible calls ‘Sin’ and because Sin is living contrary to the design of the Creator, it means that such people live utterly destructive life styles.
Because mankind seems to be tainted with this tendency, it also spreads like a virus unless checked. If it is left unchecked, the moral direction of any society is downwards, as our own society is showing at the beginning of the twenty first century.
iii) Israel’s folly
God knew that if Israel simply went into the land and mingled with the idol worshippers there, they would soon be led astray by them. Hence the objective of removing all the existing inhabitants.
Today we understand the need to destroy Cancer cells before they destroy the body. We may not understand it because we don’t understand the awfulness and destructiveness of Sin, but what we are considering in this question is a surgical operation.
A number of the wars fought in the last century and, indeed, in this century, have been those fought to prevent something worse happen. This is what was behind God’s instructions to Israel (but wait until you get to Part c) below before you make a final judgment!)
In fact this mingling with the idol worshippers did happen, even while Israel were wandering in the desert on the way to the land (see Numbers 25:1,2).
After Israel had settled in the land and after their leader Joshua had died, they quickly gave way to this tendency again (e.g. Judges 2:10-13).
In fact so often did they give way, that eventually the Lord allowed the inhabitants who had not been cleared out of the land to remain to act as a thorn in Israel’s side to continually bring them to their senses (see Judges 2:18-23)
There followed a continuing cycle in their early centuries in the land: apostasy (e.g. Judges 3:7) – disciplinary judgment (Judges 3:8) – repentance (Judges 3:9a) – deliverance from God (Judges 3:9b,10) – peace (Judges 3:11).
c) Options of the Inhabitants
Returning now to our original question, we must look at the possibilities that were given to the inhabitants, which fit in with all that we have said so far.
There were actually three options:
Option No.1 – To leave the Land
There was nothing to stop the inhabitants leaving the land and this some did.
Option No.2 – To join Israel
Some of the inhabitants actually joined the people of Israel and this was perfectly acceptable. Examples of this were Rahab, a spy-prostitute (Joshua 6:25), and the Gibeonite tribe (read Joshua 9).
Option No.3 – To resist God and Israel and die
This did happen for a number – but it was their choice! Similarly today as we saw in 2 Peter 2:9 the choice of death is a personal choice and NOT what God wants.
Our Difficulty in Understanding
We need to understand and hang on to the basic reasoning behind the instruction from God to destroy any unbelieving idolaters who resisted. It was to remove a scourge of pagan lifestyle and to do all possible to prevent Israel being corrupted. The picture given above, of Cancer, needs to be borne in mind.
Where we have a difficulty in understanding all this, it is probably because we fail to see the awfulness of Sin and its consequences.
We live very much in a Society where virtually everything goes and because of that we find it difficult to grasp the concept of wrong that is so abhorrent to a Perfect God that He has to deal with it with destructive judgment to prevent worse happening.
And that brings us right back to the subject of Jesus. To pick up again on one of the earlier verses we quoted (Romans 6:23) “the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus“.
God is always wanting to bring life. WE are the ones who refuse it and prefer death instead!
May it not be so.
January 4, 2009 at 1:47 am |
Thank you soooo much for this mini Bible lesson. I have been a Christian for over 20 years and I don’t know everything there is to know about God. I know God has been very good and more than fair to me, but reading the book of Joshua the last few days, it really made me wonder why God would have all those surrounding citites and kings destroyed. I feel good about the answers you have provided. … And it is true, God is good to ALL that go to Him with a repented heart and the Bible does say, “Taste and see that the Lord is good.” God bless you and thanks again.
February 26, 2009 at 4:17 am |
In reading your response to the question “Why did God order Isarel to kill men, women and children?”, I thought it was interesting that you never mentioned the children.
If God ordered the Israelites to kill “everyone” that would include children, even young children. Killing pregnant women would even kill unborn children.
I’ve heard an argument against abortion claiming that the unborn child doesn’t get a choice. What choice is God allowing unborn children if God orders that pregnant women within the city be killed.
Everyone would also include newborns and toddlers.
March 3, 2009 at 7:36 am |
Hmmm, sorry about that – it was not a conscious omission. Yes, it certainly did I’m afraid and that offends our modern sensibilities and rightly so. This is one of the tough questions of the Bible and, I think, can only be understood if we can grasp the bigger picture of existing nations that were so into cultic idolatry that there was no option but to completely clear them from the Land. Babies are simply the next generation who would be led the same way. The question about babies raises a bigger question – that of the destination of the person and, here, of the child or baby. Three comments are appropriate here. First, I am utterly convinced from long study of the Bible that God doesn’t make mistakes and so when we come face to face with God, if He allows us to look back on our time on earth, even though we may not understand it now, we will see then that there was nothing for which we could criticise Him. Second, I believe God’s ‘all-knowing’ ability includes knowing the ‘what ifs’ of life. What if that child had lived – would it have turned to God. God knows, I believe, even in respect of babies and they ‘destination’ will be just. Finally, we mostly cannot grasp that these three score years and ten are but a drop in the ocean in terms of eternity and people die prematurely for a variety of reasons. The crucial issue is not when they die (how old or how young) but where are they going when they depart this world. I hope these comments help in some small way in this difficult area.
March 12, 2009 at 9:29 am |
If these people’s slaughter was necessary to stop corruption of the holy land, according to god’s plan, then god failed. Look at the state of these lands today, their murders were in vain. If it’s part of god’s plan to murder children then he needs to come up with a better plan. If god tells me to kill a pregnant woman I’m not going to do it no matter what his plan is. Maybe if god first revealed what his plan was it would be easier to understand but he doesn’t he just says kill. This is just more proof that the bible is false and these people were not lead by god. What would of been more divine? Slaughter everyone or everything? Or the matter being solved diplomatically without bloodshed and not one innocent child being killed? If they did the latter that would of been more compelling evidence of a god.
March 20, 2009 at 6:51 am |
Thank you Andrew fro your comment. You very rightly feel aggrieved on behalf of people, people who lived in a pagan worshipping land though. One of the things most of us don’t realise is the primitive nature of society in the days that we are referring to. This was a day when nation fought nation (what has changed!) and the media weren’t there to touch our sensitivities so when people went to war they wiped out whole communities without exception. It’s how a sinful world works, a world where people exercise free will to do wrong. Diplomacy in such times was largely the figment of the imagination, especially when you were dealing with the more pagan societies such as we find in Canaan. This was a bunch of primitives who sacrificed their children in their superstitious rituals – and you want to save this sort of behaviour? The other thing to remember is that death was not the only option. Yes, it was the instruction – to clear the land – but the options were leave the land and live, join Israel or die. To catch God’s wider heart on all this see Ezekiel 18:23,32 and 2 Peter 3:9 in the Bible. We need to get a fuller picture to understand the realities of what is involved here, so then we would know that in fact God HAD revealed His plan very clearly previously and it was perfectly clear and very reasonable.
March 25, 2009 at 3:24 pm |
I have recently been reading numbers and deuteronomy and cannot wrap my head around god telling the israelites to kill the women and children who were not combatants… You find in the new testament, jesus warning any person that harms an innocent child that they would be better off to tie themselves to an anchor and jump in the sea. children can be so easily molded and are full of potential. depending on how they are guided through adolescence they could have been integrated into the israeli society. i just cant get a grasp on this as a christian, it is very challenging for me to accept this.
March 26, 2009 at 7:13 am |
Thank you for your thoughtful comments Bryan. As an initial answer I would ask you to read the blog again to take in the various points that are made there, because answers are given there.
However, to specifically pick up on what you have said: I accept fully Jesus’ teaching but you make two interesting points: the first is noting Jesus referring to ‘innocent’ children and the second noting that children can be easily molded. Yes, this is the tragedy of Canaan – and indeed our own societies today in the West – our once innocent children are being polluted by the world they live in and so they become the next generation to continue the wrongs of the previous one. Yes, there will be individuals who will stand out but most will follow the current trend. Put that into the context of Canaan (and you also see it in the history of the kings of Israel) and the children are simply the next generation to be pagans carrying out pagan worship and offering sacrifices of their children etc. Most of us cannot comprehend the awfulness of the state of that pagan land. Indeed as I have commented in these blogs, the Canaanites had three options – leave the land, join Israel (as you commented) or stay and fight and die – the choice was theirs. The end outcome was a purified land that could start afresh. There is the additional point that theologians point out, and that is that none of us are innocent and all of us deserve to die for our sin – that would be justice. But the incredible truth is that God sent His Son to die in our place so that we could live. Read the blogs and see the points – God is more concerned with life than with death. That is clear from both Old and New Testaments. Thanks again for writing.
April 9, 2009 at 1:23 am |
genocide will always be quite a difficult thing to justify. I find it strange that i, as an atheist can declare that genicide is always wrong. It is because of your belief in an ancient superstition that you cannot admit it is always wrong.
You sound no better than a nazi explaining that aushwitz was all for the best- that it was for some greater good
If your god wanted babies murdered he should have done it himself
April 13, 2009 at 5:50 am |
Sadly I think your comments indicate that you haven’t properly read what I’ve written otherwise you would see that genocide is very far from God’s heart. Can I suggest you put down your prejudice and read objectively with an open mind what I’ve written, then perhaps we can discuss the issues more reasonably.
April 27, 2009 at 4:54 pm |
In the Book, The Bible Handbook, written by Henry H. Halley, we read that at the ancient ruins of Megiddo were found ruins of a temple of Ashtoreth, goddess-wife of Baal. Mr. Halley writes: “Just a few steps from this temple was a cemetery, where many jars were found, containing remains of infants who had been sacrificed in this temple . . . Prophets of Baal and Ashtoreth were official murderers of little children.” “Another horrible practice was [what] they called ‘foundation sacrifices.’ When a house was to be built, a child would be sacrificed, and its body built into the wall.”
Halley further writes: “The worship of Baal, Ashtoreth, and other Canaanite gods consisted in the most extravagant orgies; their temples were centers of vice. . . . Canaanites worshiped, by immoral indulgence, . . . and then, by murdering their first-born children, as a sacrifice to these same gods. It seems that, in large measure, the land of Canaan had become a sort of Sodom and Gomorrah on a national scale. . . . Did a civilization of such abominable filth and brutality have any right longer to exist? . . . Archaeologists who dig in the ruins of Canaanite cities wonder that God did not destroy them sooner than He did.”
May 5, 2009 at 6:26 am |
Thank you Matthew for that contribution – I must look up my Bible Handbook a bit more. Perhaps just a postscript – the fact that God doesn’t destroy all those we think He should suggests He is incredibly patient as suggested by Peter in 2 Pet 3:8,9. I am constantly surprised by the wonder of God’s grace and mercy that holds back and keeps giving more and more opportunity for repentance. Thank you again.
May 4, 2009 at 7:03 am |
I don’t understand how you can keep saying to people that they haven’t properly read your comments. I’ve read them, twice, and they say the same thing, god had a plan, he was complacent in the killing of innocent people, in fact he ordered it. If he is all knowing and all powerful, and as you said previously, god knows the “destination” of babies, than there is no free will, he chose for us before it was written, who we would be, what we would do, and he punished us for being who and what he created. We have been stuck with the original sin which was enacted as soon as Eve ate from the apple of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, if she never knew evil, or goodness or had knowledge, how could she decide for herself to eat/not eat the apple and condemn the world through eternity. She never had a choice and the all-knowing, all-powerful, god knew what would happen and let it be, thereby creating the world as we know it. There is no way possible to escape sin, there is no choice. And in order to enter into heaven you must proclaim jesus the son of god and since the children and babies that were killed could never understand this, they have been condemned to hell as well.
Congratulations on following such a just and loving god, I’d rather take my chances.
May 5, 2009 at 6:21 am |
OK fede, thanks for your reply and your thoughtfulness. Can I suggest, first of all, that there is a big difference between God MAKING things happen and God KNOWING what will happen. Second, I would suggest that Eve DID have a choice. The fact that she gave way to Satan didn’t mean that she HAD to. Even today each one of us chooses whether to listen to the negatives of another person or reject them. Eve had that same choice. The fact that she was the first person to make that choice doesn’t matter; it was still a true choice. Third, your comments about being ’stuck’ with original sin raise interesting questions. You also go on to speak about the world being condemned for eternity. These suggest you come from a part of the world where the church preaches only half a story – a negative half. Yes, sin was the inheritance of every person after Eve but that didn’t stop God entering into relationships with individuals – e.g. Enoch, Abram, Moses etc. etc. and then Israel – and anyone else who sought Him (according to Paul in Romans) – and He would have been able to do this because He had already planned before He made the world – knowing what would happen – to send Jesus to die in our place to take the punishment for our sins. Thus because He knew that the cost of sin would be dealt with at a specific point of history (2000 years ago) He could still enter into relationships with whoever sought Him out. When it comes to children, theologians talk about the age of responsibility and thus babies are not held accountable. I prefer to think that God also knows the “what might have been” and so could see every baby and see what they would have turned out to be – but that is pure speculation. All I can tell you is that for many years I have known this God, studied the Bible and conclude from both experience and reading that you and I are talking about a loving God. Forgive me but you sound like you have come from a starting place where you made up your mind before you started talking. That is not good intellectually. If we start investigating with an open mind to start with, I am convinced we come up with this conclusion. We may have to think through a load of questions (as you appear to be doing) but that is the inevitable conclusion when we see the fuller picture. Thank you again for your comments.
May 9, 2009 at 8:18 am |
Hello again,
If god is ominipotent, omniscient, and ominipresent, he is then all powerful, all knowing, ever being. He not only created us but he knew what we would become. He had the power to decide for us, to make us what he would.
Psalm 139:15,16- My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place. When I was woven together in the depths of the earth. your eyes saw my unformed body. All the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be.
Jeremiah 1:5; Job 31:15; Genesis 25:23; These are but a few of the verses that acknowledge god not only knew what would happen but created the event/person in the fashion that he proposed.
First, genesis 3:1 states :Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the lord god had made. He said to the woman, “Did god really say, “You must not eat from any tree in the garden?”
Nowhere does it state that serpent was the devil/satan or any other evil-doer. And god goes on in v. 14 to curse the serpent and create hatred between the serpent and humans and each others’ offspring. He never calls him satan.
In ch 2 v. 9 it states in the middle of the garden were the tree of life and the tree of knowledge of good and evil(two separate trees) in v. 17 god explains to Adam he must not eat from the tree of knowledge. ch 3 v 2 eve says to the serpent the lord said she may not eat from the tree in the middle of the garden. Perhaps she didn’t know which tree was which? How could she know she was doing wrong if she had no knowledge of good and evil..after all they were naked and only realised that was wrong after they ate of the tree of knowledge. So again, I say, she didn’t know what she was doing, she had no knowledge to understand not until she actually ate of the tree.
If god already planned to send his son, to die for our sins, he knew the way the world was going to turn out, what is the point of being omnipotent, if you don’t use it? And why did he not use himself as sacrifice? why his son?
You prefer to think god knew every baby and what they would have turned out to be. Is that your way of excusing the genocide of children, babies and pregnant women and still be able to call god loving? I find nothing loving about that. Your god uses fear throughout the bible to bring man into the “fold”. How can you claim free will when there really is no choice? Either you follow me, or die? This is what we now call, bullying.
First you say I’m not thinking intellectually, that we must think through a load of questions, (you say I appear to be doing) if I am thinking through questions I must be thinking intellegently, the only difference is your supposition is different than my own. So naturally, the christian view is, I must be wrong. I do not come to these conclusions lightly either, as a matter of fact, my mind was following in the direction your mind has gone, as I grew up, logic took over, fear went away, and I was more capable of actually reading for myself ALL of the bible and not just the parts most religionists want you to read. I could see for myself that fear was the main factor in following “the word” As many times it might say in the bible, god is good, god is loving, there are more times it talks of his anger, you must be fearful, I would rather not live my life in fear. All churches only preach half the story, if they preached the whole thing it would become more obvious to more people that this bible was written by(fallable)men, for men, in order to create fear, discipline and order, where there was none. For you to use certain parts of the bible to excuse the practice of genocide is hypocritical, at best. A faith that goes on the premise of love thy neighbor as thyself, thou shalt not murder,judge not lest ye be judged, there sure is alot of persecution and murder in the name of religion, but,as long as it’s in the name of the lord.
The morality is lost here. Even for god, might does not make right and you can’t absolve the action just because god told you it was okay. Murder is murder, judgement is judgement, fear is fear, hate is hate, no matter how you look at it.
June 18, 2009 at 8:44 am |
It would appear the author of the blog post doesn’t care to respond to fede’s comment.
I guess sometimes you just have to admit that you have no way to come to a mutual understanding. Some people are so set in their belief systems that they are unable to observe it from the outside in.
It’s a shame that someone would be doomed to die before they could walk or talk. A loving god would have given them the choice, and the ability to make a loving intelligent choice, rather than make it so that they would choose evil no matter what and thus justify killing them, and ALL of their potential descendants preemptively… (when you take a life, you [usually] don’t just take one life, you’re taking that one and all of their children, grandchildren, great-grandchildren, great-great-grandchildren, etc… massive numbers of people with as many potential life paths as anybody else.)
It’s a shame that people are raised to believe something so deeply that they are unable to consider reality from other perspectives. It’s rather disempowering.
June 20, 2009 at 7:43 am
I accept the rebuke! I have apologised for my omission. If I respond to your comments by starting at the end. I agree entirely with your sentiments in your final two sentences. The only trouble is that they don’t apply to me. I was not brought up in the church or as a Christian. I became a Christian in my early twenties and have spent the years since researching my beliefs.
I think the pro-life, anti-abortion lobby would rejoice in the opening line of your main paragraph, and indeed much of that paragraph is wonderfully pro-life and I agree with you. Perhaps a key to all this is in Ezekiel chapter 18 where God declares, “I take no pleasure in the death of anyone… repent and live.” (see also 18:23) What I find frustrating whenever I get comments referring to ‘genocide’ is that what took place with Israel was not genocide. The objective was not to wipe out a people for the sake of it, but to wipe out horrible pagan practices which DID involve child sacrifice and other ghastly barbaric practices. As I have sought to explain in my writings, there were clearly three options for the inhabitants of Canaan: 1. Leave! (and some did) 2. Change and become a changed people, part of Israel (and some did). 3. Fight Israel and risk dying (and some did). In reality Israel didn’t do a very good job anyway and many of the inhabitants stayed – and God permitted their presence and in fact made use of it.
It is emotional hype that refuses to face the evidence that is there and that then reaches wrong conclusions and comes up with something that is the exact opposite of what the Bible is conveying. So yes, I agree, it is a shame that people are raised to believe something so deeply that they are unable to consider reality! But thanks for writing.
June 20, 2009 at 7:08 am |
I must apologise first of all that I obviously approved this comment but did not reply. I must have been in a hurry that morning – my apologies again. Can I pick up the points you make one by one.
You are right in saying that in Gen 3 the serpent is not identified as Satan. The fact of his role as tempter and deceiver and murderer is referred to elsewhere and it is generally accepted that this likeness is too close to miss. At the end of the Bible in the book of Revelation we find, “The great dragon was hurled down–that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray” (Rev 12:9) and “that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan” (Rev 20:2) and in the original in both the sense is “that original serpent”.
I like your arguing about Eve’s ‘confusion’ yet in the face of the text it doesn’t hold up. 3:6 clearly indicates that she knew what she was doing – at least as far as specifically going for a specific tree and going against what God had said. That she could not know (having never sinned) what it would be like and what it would bring about is undisputed.
I appreciate your testimony and I am sorry that you have had the experience of Christianity that you have had. I’m afraid we, the church, don’t do a very good job in communicating very often and fear is conveyed when love and grace should be. I also appreciate your intentions in the argument that is linked with your testimony yet I believe they are more wrapped up in your emotions than in your intellect. Please, that is not to demean your intellect but simply says that your negative experiences of the past appear to cloud your present investigative powers to arrive at a conclusion that you want, rather than a conclusion to be found by the evidence.
So concerned am I by the anguish and hostility that comes over so often on the Internet, that I am in the process of writing a book looking for clarification about “the love of God” which I’ll put on line eventually. This will not be casual stuff but intellectually demanding. There is strong evidence that many in today’s younger generations are incapable of objective assessment of the evidence because they have been fed emotional negatives. This, I suspect, is true of every one of us in the West in the twenty first century, and I find myself having to question my assumptions again and again and ask, what objectively is the truth here, and that applies as much to the Bible as anywhere else. That may be another reason why I am happy for people to question and question and question for, I am convinced, IF there is objective seeking, then the truth will come to the surface.
Again my apologies for not responding earlier.
July 2, 2009 at 5:23 pm |
I would like to contact faithcatalyst for some questions I have. Could this be done outside this forum?
July 3, 2009 at 6:17 am |
yes, you’ll get an e-mail from me that you can reply to.
August 26, 2009 at 8:17 am |
it is impossible to understand the nature of god sorry
August 30, 2009 at 7:23 am |
This is where the Bible is unique in that it reveals a lot about God in terms of His interacting with people and with Israel. For a simple starting place, try thinking about Exodus 34:6 where God Himself reveals to Moses: “The Lord, the compassionate and gracious God, slow to anger, abounding in love and faithfulness.” Now if that IS the truth about God, then it may be that we have to look differently at the Bible, history and so on. Instead of writing off that description, think about each of those descriptions and then read the Bible with them in the back of your mind. Most people who say God cannot be understood do not read the Bible. However, one must agree with you that at the end of it, although the Bible gives us sufficient knowledge to be able to enter into a relationship with God, it is only a tiny bit of information and so ultimately He is beyond our human finite minds. Don’t apologise. Just read and then worship.
September 1, 2009 at 9:19 am |
I have read and learned in religious schools most of my life. I see from bible that when nations are so evil and judgement is finally brought by God after they had time to repent does seem to sometimes include collective punishment. God chose to remove the nations of Canaan and gave the Israelites his permission and guided them. We living in this century can’t fathom the evil of those days(child sacrifice etc) Our religion teaches us that although nations have judgements passed on them by God (such as Ninveh-Jonah and Whale) and when Israelites were conquered by Babylonians for their sins that God wants repentance and for us to change our ways. God does search for righteous individuals and wants us to live good lives. I read book of Jeremiah and see how hated he was by the people for his future prophecies of exile. When he was thrown in pit a slave of the king helped pull him out and God told Jeremiah to tell the slave/servant that when Banylonians attack the servant will escape with his life. There are other people mentioned in Jeremiah that did good deeds and escaped. Ww must always try to improve ourselves and create harmony in our homes. Looking backwards and asking why evil pagan nations were exterminated when clearly God says they were low in merits seems silly to me. Every generation deals with evils and bad nations that want to destroy those who practice freedom and values taught by God. We today face many of those same challenges as we see in war with terrorism. If we fight evil around us and work to correct how we behave among our own families/communities I believe God will respond and bless us. It may take longer than we expect but I have no doubt that a day will come when God will be again reveal himself in a fierce wondrous manner as he did with miracles of exodus from Egypt and all doubts of God existence will cease. We have a prophecy that Elijah will come back in future and give guidance to man. I have experienced good and bad times in my life but I have chosen to not lose faith and learn from it all.
September 2, 2009 at 6:26 am |
Thank you Nicole for a very positive comment and for a great deal of wisdom.
September 22, 2009 at 9:41 pm |
I have been reading Joshua and had the same question as what this topic is about. I am glad you posted it and agree with you. One question I have is on the 3 options that the inhabitants had. The first was to leave, second was to join forces, and third was to fight and resist, however in Joshua 11:20 – “For it was the LORD himself who hardened their hearts to wage war against Israel, so that he might destroy them totally, exterminating them without mercy, as the LORD had commanded Moses.” did the kings really have an option?
September 25, 2009 at 5:56 am |
Good question! When we come to times in the Bible when we see that God hardened somebody’s heart (Pharaoh in Exodus is THE classic example of this), what actually happens is that the Lord either acts or speaks in such a way that that the ALREADY hard hearts are hardened more. All that means is that they determine to resist even more. Now there would have been those in Canaan (only a few no doubt) who were open for something other than the pagan child-sacrificing worship that existed in that land and they would have been open to the Lord and realised the futility of opposing Him (e.g. the Gibeonites in Josh 9) and came over to Israel, admittedly by a ruse. Yet for most of the Canaanites, they were so given over to their idol worship that their hearts were hardened against God by it and thus He knew that He had only to press them and they would simply dig in against Him and thus fight against Israel and eventually be defeated and die. To sum it up: God sees their hearts are set and knows there is no alternative; their hearts are set on continuing with child-sacrifice etc. and so He determines to remove them. Yes, we always have options but sometimes people so establish themselves in their ungodliness and unrighteousness that (and only the Lord knows this, not us) they don’t want to take the options and thus harden their hearts more and more when they are challenged. It is one of the unpleasant mysteries of sin. I hope that helps. Thank you for asking.
November 5, 2009 at 11:24 am |
God the Lord of Israel was right in asking the Israelites to kill babies, because by doing so they proved that their god was not really God but a demon in diguise. The asshole of a god yahweh should be declared as the most retarded God who ever lived.
November 6, 2009 at 7:21 am |
Well that sounds rather an angry comment. Unfortunately it is also a highly uninformed comment. If you read widely on this particular blog – not just one writing but the many others AND the links elsewhere – I believe you will find that your anger is misplaced when it comes to God. I’m sorry you feel like that.